whr
I plan on backpacking Europe in May from the 7-31 and this is the itinerary I have come up with: 8-10 in Amsterdam, 11th in Brussels, 13-15 in Paris, 16-18 in Barcelona, 19-21 in Rome, 22-25 in Greece, 26-27 in Prague, 28-30 in Berlin...and then I would fly back home to the USA on the 31. Alright, so I'm not sure about the travel times between these places and my only concern is that I don't want to end up spending half of my days wholly on trains. I will say that I would plan on taking the night trains and sleeping on them; I would prefer my schedule be full and hectic than to have any down time. I've thought about replacing Greece with London and inserting it into my schedule accordingly but perhaps attempting to take the ferry to either would require too much time and I should just stay on the mainland? Any cities I'm overlooking? Thanks!
Thanks for the replies so far! Greece is out of the way, but yeah I think I'm going to go for it. Also, I will say I'm most excited for the night life in each city and I'm going to try and just see the major attractions,maybe take a day tour and then a day to myself. I was just thinking, would it perhaps work better for me to go east first- ams.-berl.- prague-greece-rome-barcelona-paris-brussels ??
Answer
No way, baby! There is too much ground to cover. I'd slow down and enjoy a few places more, and also leave some room for flexibility- you'll miss trains, get sidetracked, find a cool village that you HAVE to see, a daytrip that can't wait, etc etc. Unless you are flying, Greece takes a LONG time to get in and out of- trust me on this. Paris to Barcelona can take time- just the trip is over 12 hours, never mind if you have to make a connection. Rome to Greece overland is about 2-3 days, figuring on Rome-Brindisi-Patras and then onwards; and the trains don't meet the ferries, so you usually have to stay overnight on one end. Then getting to Prague from Greece? That's another 2-3 days easy. Barcelona-Rome is a LONG way also, another 2-3 days of travel. Barcy can be kind of hard to get out of- it's not super-well connected with night trains, and you might have to go through Toulouse and Lyon. I did a similar route my first time, and I travelled for three months... and still felt rushed sometimes.
I know you want to see everything, but it's just not possible. You'll end up too time-stressed to enjoy it. London takes a long time to get in or out of also- even flying, because the cheap airlines fly out of outside airports, which take time to get to.
I seriously would not attempt to plug Greece into this itinerary- unless you decide to not do Barcy-Paris-Brussels. (BTW, for Belgium, Brugges is MUCH, MUCH nicer than Brussels- don't go to big cities just because they're famous!) You say Greece, but where?? Athens is no big deal as a city, aside from a few astounding sites- the best of Greece is in the smaller places, which takes a lot of time.
See, what you'll end up doing on this trip is finding out how much you're missing in each country- make sense? You'll be in Prague, say, and someone will tell you about Ceske Krumlov or Kutna Hora, (both totally amazing) and you'll regret not having the time. And each city you mention is worth at least 3 or 4 days just to see the main sites, never mind hidden gems. A museum like the Louvre is easily one or two full days by itself- it's not something you check out for an hour. It takes time to get around-
BTW- I guarantee that you'll get stuck in Berlin and Prague- they're just amazing.
Rome is great, but don't forget that Florence is the seat of the Renaissance, easier to get to, and closer to the rest of Europe. Stay out of Milan and Naples- your time is far better spent elsewhere.
I HIGHLY recommend reading Rick Steve's "Europe Through the Back Door" before going- it is totally invaluable in planning your first trip. He has packing advice, train and itinerary maps, sightseeing routes in each city, and a ton of fun tips- he's a guru. The library should have it.
Here's three site for train info- just type in your route.
http://www.b-rail.be/main/E/
http://www.bahn.de/international/view/en/index.shtml
http://www.raileurope.com/index.html
BTW, here are some of my favorites on the continent:
Mostar, Bosnia
Brugges
Ljubljana, Slovenia (spent 4 months in Slovenia!)
Zagreb, Hvar, and Dubrovnik, Croatia
Prague and Ceske Krumlov, Czech Republic
Granada, Spain
Cinque Terra, Florence, Taormina, Pompeii, and Capri/Amalfi- Italy
Sarlat and the Dordogne- France- and Strasburg also
Santorini, Nafplio, and Agios Pavlos- Greece
Leiden- Holland
Vienna and Salzburg- Austria
Berlin
Rememer- Europe has been there for a LONG time- you can always go back. It's better to concentrate on a smaller region with your limited time- like the Mediterranean, or only the Central/Eastern, or just Italy, Greece, the Balkans, and Turkey- Europe is HUGE- it's easy to look at a map and get deceived about how much ground you can cover-
Have fun!
No way, baby! There is too much ground to cover. I'd slow down and enjoy a few places more, and also leave some room for flexibility- you'll miss trains, get sidetracked, find a cool village that you HAVE to see, a daytrip that can't wait, etc etc. Unless you are flying, Greece takes a LONG time to get in and out of- trust me on this. Paris to Barcelona can take time- just the trip is over 12 hours, never mind if you have to make a connection. Rome to Greece overland is about 2-3 days, figuring on Rome-Brindisi-Patras and then onwards; and the trains don't meet the ferries, so you usually have to stay overnight on one end. Then getting to Prague from Greece? That's another 2-3 days easy. Barcelona-Rome is a LONG way also, another 2-3 days of travel. Barcy can be kind of hard to get out of- it's not super-well connected with night trains, and you might have to go through Toulouse and Lyon. I did a similar route my first time, and I travelled for three months... and still felt rushed sometimes.
I know you want to see everything, but it's just not possible. You'll end up too time-stressed to enjoy it. London takes a long time to get in or out of also- even flying, because the cheap airlines fly out of outside airports, which take time to get to.
I seriously would not attempt to plug Greece into this itinerary- unless you decide to not do Barcy-Paris-Brussels. (BTW, for Belgium, Brugges is MUCH, MUCH nicer than Brussels- don't go to big cities just because they're famous!) You say Greece, but where?? Athens is no big deal as a city, aside from a few astounding sites- the best of Greece is in the smaller places, which takes a lot of time.
See, what you'll end up doing on this trip is finding out how much you're missing in each country- make sense? You'll be in Prague, say, and someone will tell you about Ceske Krumlov or Kutna Hora, (both totally amazing) and you'll regret not having the time. And each city you mention is worth at least 3 or 4 days just to see the main sites, never mind hidden gems. A museum like the Louvre is easily one or two full days by itself- it's not something you check out for an hour. It takes time to get around-
BTW- I guarantee that you'll get stuck in Berlin and Prague- they're just amazing.
Rome is great, but don't forget that Florence is the seat of the Renaissance, easier to get to, and closer to the rest of Europe. Stay out of Milan and Naples- your time is far better spent elsewhere.
I HIGHLY recommend reading Rick Steve's "Europe Through the Back Door" before going- it is totally invaluable in planning your first trip. He has packing advice, train and itinerary maps, sightseeing routes in each city, and a ton of fun tips- he's a guru. The library should have it.
Here's three site for train info- just type in your route.
http://www.b-rail.be/main/E/
http://www.bahn.de/international/view/en/index.shtml
http://www.raileurope.com/index.html
BTW, here are some of my favorites on the continent:
Mostar, Bosnia
Brugges
Ljubljana, Slovenia (spent 4 months in Slovenia!)
Zagreb, Hvar, and Dubrovnik, Croatia
Prague and Ceske Krumlov, Czech Republic
Granada, Spain
Cinque Terra, Florence, Taormina, Pompeii, and Capri/Amalfi- Italy
Sarlat and the Dordogne- France- and Strasburg also
Santorini, Nafplio, and Agios Pavlos- Greece
Leiden- Holland
Vienna and Salzburg- Austria
Berlin
Rememer- Europe has been there for a LONG time- you can always go back. It's better to concentrate on a smaller region with your limited time- like the Mediterranean, or only the Central/Eastern, or just Italy, Greece, the Balkans, and Turkey- Europe is HUGE- it's easy to look at a map and get deceived about how much ground you can cover-
Have fun!
Tips on flying long haul with 14mth baby. Any advice?
Happy Fami
I will be flying from Melbourne, Australia to London UK with my baby daughter who will be 14 months. I have flown between the two cities before but never with baby. Will be flying Singapore Airlines (love them and apparently they are good for babies) and plan on going for three weeks (that's all the time off we can afford).
Things to consider:
1) Dont really want to give her sedatives
2) She is usually breastfed to sleep (which can be handy but also...tricky!)
3) I will be bringing portable DVD player, lots of nappies, plastic bags, small toys and get them out one at a time, will be using a baby carrier, books, wipes - that's all the advice I have so far...
Please share your experience and offer some helpful tips.
Answer
I'm a former Flight Attendant and I fly a lot of long-haul flights with my three children.
I have never used sedatives. I'm allergic to a lot of them myself so I can't risk it with my kids, especially at 30,000ft. without an emergency room nearby. These are not harmless drugs and while I don't diss parents who use them on long journeys, it's not something that systematically should be done. There can be side effects. I've survived without. You can too.
Besides, on such a long flight, she'll sleep at some points anyway (10 minutes before landing lol!)
Sounds like you have had some good advice. All three of mine were breastfed and this actually will make your trip easier (the oldest did have some bottles but they're harder to travel with). It's a great way to calm them down when they get overtired, which often happens in airports.
Remember that you do NOT have to breastfeed her or make her drink on take-off and landing. This is an common myth. If you are using a car seat, be sure she's strapped in during those times. Mine flew in car seats and didn't take pacifiers and they never had any problems with their ears. Please don't wake your child unnecessarily and/or force her to drink when she doesn't want to.
The best way to avoid ear problems is to schedule a "well baby" visit right before leaving. Her ears will be checked to be sure that she doesn't have an ear infection or other blockage. Flying with something like that is painful. No amount of sucking will help and it can actually be damaging to the ears. These are problems that are easy to avoid and fix.
Speaking of car seats, I really recommend using one at this age. It really wasn't a big deal to bring it on board on a wire foldable luggage cart. I saw both my passengers and my own children were calmer and more settled in their familiar seat. If she doesn't have a seat, ask nicely at check-in if it's possible to get an extra place. Take it to the gate regardless and if you are not success, have your seat "gate-checked" with the strollers and wheelchairs. This is no guarantee but better than checking it at the desk. NEVER check a car seat as luggage. Airlines lose and break checked car seats all the time.
Here's the children's page from Singapore Airlines;
http://www.singaporeair.com/saa/en_UK/content/before/plan/specialneeds.jsp
If you don't need a car seat in London, you might want to look into the CARES harness, which is easy to bring and accepted on Singapore.
http://www.kidsflysafe.com/
Practice changing her standing up before leaving. You'll love this tip in London too where baby changers aren't that common. The changing tables on airplanes are really small and if you can change her in this position, you can use the roomier handicapped lav instead.
Don't forget to pack a couple of changes of clothes and be sure you have enough diapers. She'll go through more on this trip than she would in the same time frame at home. Often, you'll find yourself changing her when you can, rather than when it's necessary, such as right before boarding and landing. Wrap all this stuff in plastic and bind with rubber bands to make more room in your bag.
This is the bib I liked when travelling. It rinses out easily and dries quickly. I found taking this beat a bunch of disposable bibs, especially because it really kept mine clean. It really covers them up because kids get messy on planes. This company makes really bad baby carriers but this bib is great!
http://www.babycity.co.uk/baby-gifts/mealtimes-cutlery-highchairs-baby-bibs/baby-bjorn/baby-bjorn-eat-play-smock-pd-1155.html
Skip a purse and diaper bag and use a big backpack and a small purse around your neck with the essentials. Keep your hands free. I get a bigger backpack that goes up to my knee when placed on the floor. Both of you carry one, one with the extra supplies, and one with what you need. I also take a small cloth bag so that when I took them to change them, I didn't have to drag the whole bag along.
Are you sure she'll watch DVD's? Mine were way too active at that age to watch a screen and no way would they have worn the headsets. She absolutely has to wear them. Playing it over the speakers would be annoying to other passengers. Be really sure that she'll wear them before leaving. Otherwise, the new toys are a good idea. One right before the plane pushes back because that's a really bad time for toddlers to stay seated. Hopefully, it'll distract her and you can't use any electrical items during that time.
For more information, ten years ago I wrote an article on this subject. It's based on both my personal and professional experience of flying with children. It's totally non-commercial and other parents from around the world have contributed;
http://flyingwithchildren1.blogspot.com
It's a tricky age and a long flight but if you're organized, it'll be much easier.
Have a good visit to London!
I'm a former Flight Attendant and I fly a lot of long-haul flights with my three children.
I have never used sedatives. I'm allergic to a lot of them myself so I can't risk it with my kids, especially at 30,000ft. without an emergency room nearby. These are not harmless drugs and while I don't diss parents who use them on long journeys, it's not something that systematically should be done. There can be side effects. I've survived without. You can too.
Besides, on such a long flight, she'll sleep at some points anyway (10 minutes before landing lol!)
Sounds like you have had some good advice. All three of mine were breastfed and this actually will make your trip easier (the oldest did have some bottles but they're harder to travel with). It's a great way to calm them down when they get overtired, which often happens in airports.
Remember that you do NOT have to breastfeed her or make her drink on take-off and landing. This is an common myth. If you are using a car seat, be sure she's strapped in during those times. Mine flew in car seats and didn't take pacifiers and they never had any problems with their ears. Please don't wake your child unnecessarily and/or force her to drink when she doesn't want to.
The best way to avoid ear problems is to schedule a "well baby" visit right before leaving. Her ears will be checked to be sure that she doesn't have an ear infection or other blockage. Flying with something like that is painful. No amount of sucking will help and it can actually be damaging to the ears. These are problems that are easy to avoid and fix.
Speaking of car seats, I really recommend using one at this age. It really wasn't a big deal to bring it on board on a wire foldable luggage cart. I saw both my passengers and my own children were calmer and more settled in their familiar seat. If she doesn't have a seat, ask nicely at check-in if it's possible to get an extra place. Take it to the gate regardless and if you are not success, have your seat "gate-checked" with the strollers and wheelchairs. This is no guarantee but better than checking it at the desk. NEVER check a car seat as luggage. Airlines lose and break checked car seats all the time.
Here's the children's page from Singapore Airlines;
http://www.singaporeair.com/saa/en_UK/content/before/plan/specialneeds.jsp
If you don't need a car seat in London, you might want to look into the CARES harness, which is easy to bring and accepted on Singapore.
http://www.kidsflysafe.com/
Practice changing her standing up before leaving. You'll love this tip in London too where baby changers aren't that common. The changing tables on airplanes are really small and if you can change her in this position, you can use the roomier handicapped lav instead.
Don't forget to pack a couple of changes of clothes and be sure you have enough diapers. She'll go through more on this trip than she would in the same time frame at home. Often, you'll find yourself changing her when you can, rather than when it's necessary, such as right before boarding and landing. Wrap all this stuff in plastic and bind with rubber bands to make more room in your bag.
This is the bib I liked when travelling. It rinses out easily and dries quickly. I found taking this beat a bunch of disposable bibs, especially because it really kept mine clean. It really covers them up because kids get messy on planes. This company makes really bad baby carriers but this bib is great!
http://www.babycity.co.uk/baby-gifts/mealtimes-cutlery-highchairs-baby-bibs/baby-bjorn/baby-bjorn-eat-play-smock-pd-1155.html
Skip a purse and diaper bag and use a big backpack and a small purse around your neck with the essentials. Keep your hands free. I get a bigger backpack that goes up to my knee when placed on the floor. Both of you carry one, one with the extra supplies, and one with what you need. I also take a small cloth bag so that when I took them to change them, I didn't have to drag the whole bag along.
Are you sure she'll watch DVD's? Mine were way too active at that age to watch a screen and no way would they have worn the headsets. She absolutely has to wear them. Playing it over the speakers would be annoying to other passengers. Be really sure that she'll wear them before leaving. Otherwise, the new toys are a good idea. One right before the plane pushes back because that's a really bad time for toddlers to stay seated. Hopefully, it'll distract her and you can't use any electrical items during that time.
For more information, ten years ago I wrote an article on this subject. It's based on both my personal and professional experience of flying with children. It's totally non-commercial and other parents from around the world have contributed;
http://flyingwithchildren1.blogspot.com
It's a tricky age and a long flight but if you're organized, it'll be much easier.
Have a good visit to London!
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Title Post: Does this itinerary for backpacking Europe seem realistic?
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Author: Unknown
Thanks For Coming To My Blog
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